Some Thoughts on Fan Service: the Editor Speaks!
Posted by Mike on 07 Aug 2008 at 10:47 pm | Categories: Editorials
Those of you who have been following the firestorm Rah’ra has caused in these here parts may have been wondering what I might have to say about these matters. Well, here they are. (This seems an appropriate time, too, to remind everyone that all opinions published are those of the individual writers and not of Anime Diet itself, its affiliates, derivatives, spin offs, and holding companies. :))
With that out of the way, I will say this: porn is in the use as much as it is in the content. Which means that in many, perhaps the majority of cases, Rah’ra is correct, even if his case is overstated as a principle and that not every instance of fan service should be treated exactly the same as a hardcore, NC-17 movie.
This article is long, like my gender article, and I think we want to start wrapping it up now, so you may skip and not feel guilty if it’s tl;dr. We’ll be back to our usual stuff soon. :)
The central question at hand is whether all sexually explicit material is pornography (as suggested by a literal reading of the dictionary definition), and particularly the kind of material that you see in anime and is called “fan service.”
What we anime fans call “fan service” is simply a synonym for what in Western media is referred to as “cheesecake” or “T&A.” In other words, it’s hardly unique to anime and manga; it appears in all kinds of Western media too. Most people make a distinction between the kind of T&A shown in, say, a Bond film and what they would commonly call pornography; many people will watch an R-rated movie which even has nudity and simulated sex but not watch an NC-17 rated “adult” film. One is called “suggestive,” and the other “explicit.” Some R-rated movies definitely come very close to crossing the line, enough that many people do deem it pornographic, but the point is that most of society does see a line between one and the other.
Rah’ra collapses this distinction, which is what is so controversial: and not without some good reason. Whether it be the famous shot of Mrs. Robinson’s leg in The Graduate or the various kinds of semi-clothed situations harem romances traffic in (especially, say, in Kanokon or Sekirei), it is true that these are mainly different from “outright porn” in degree, not in kind. The techniques, framing, and presentation are often derived from full-blown pornography, the only difference being the lack of nipples or convenient pieces of clothing or fog. Maxim rather than Penthouse, if you will, or even something milder. The degree of difference can be great, and I’m going to argue that this makes a difference, but it is on the same continuum.
And I think it’s undeniable that even this mild, sub-softcore material is in fact used as pornography by a substantial part of the viewing audience. If that weren’t true, there wouldn’t be so many fapping jokes (and the knowing laughter that follows) when it comes to shows like Strike Witches. Pornography is not just about the content, though that’s an indispensable part of it; it’s also about the use. And it’s usually fairly obvious when a show is using panty shots or boob groping in order to get a rise out of the audience–you can literally feel the camera contorting to unnatural angles to get a certain shot. Something need not even be “explicit” or commonly seen as “porn” to be a turn-on for some people; my youth pastor, for instance, made a special effort to avoid the swimsuit issue of Sports Illustrated because for him, it functioned as a pornographic temptation.
In short, a lot of fan service is porn for many people, because porn need not only mean hardcore porn where we see, as they say, “everything.” Practically anything that is fetishized–underwear, boobs, heck, cat ears–can function as it when it becomes a real source of sexual gratification.
Clearly, many readers are taking for granted that this is not a good thing, or else this debate would not have generated so much heat and even offense. While some are comfortable admitting to liking porn, many are not, and many people who watch lots of anime (like myself) might even believe that watching outright pornography is wrong/sinful (like myself). A nerve got touched real hard for people who believe the latter, because if he’s right in the way he stated it, then pretty much the majority of a given person’s anime diet, especially if one is watching recent shows of certain genres, is the same as watching lots of NC-17 movies. That is the impression given by using the word “pornography” to describe all fanservice. I’ll go further; if what Rah’ra says is true, it pretty much means I will have to stop watching the vast majority of the shows I watch and review, since many of them contain some level of sexual fanservice (though my tastes are such that I almost always dislike shows that have lots of it or where it’s the main point). Rah’ra is also, in my judgment, correct in pointing out that many fans have become desensitized to fan service in a way that an outside, more mainstream audience is not–particularly when it comes in animated form. I often only become acutely aware of certain forms of mild fan service only in the presence of those who are not all that familiar with it–say some of the brief cheesecake shots in early episodes of Evangelion.
I admit this has happened to me, and I don’t really regard this as a good thing. Part of the concern is that we ought to be sensitive to others’ sensibilities if we are trying to introduce friends and family to anime (which may not necessarily be our goal; let’s assume it is, though). I think this is what Rah’ra is getting at when he talks about “mainstream acceptance”; not that it should become more “American” but that it ought to take this into account. Plus, speaking of my own tastes, the prevalence of the harem, fan-service heavy “romantic comedy” in fandom (at least in the blogosphere and in Japan) is not the direction I want anime to go in. I want more Honey and Clovers and Kaibas and Planetes and movies like The Girl Who Leapt Through Time. That movie, Byousoku 5cm, and many Studio Ghibli films are my typical “anime to show others who aren’t fans” shows. If there could be more well-written, moving, and original material like that, without the fan service crutch, no one would be happier than me.
Still, here’s where I have some beef with our provocative editorialist:
- I really do think there is a legitimate distinction to be made between fanservice and “genuine porn.” This distinction is, admittedly, subjective to a large extent. It is mainly based on the line one wants to draw as to what is “acceptable” as far as sexual material in entertainment is and what is not. At the risk of appearing unholy or too tolerant for a future minister, I draw it at the commonly held one–the depiction of actual intercourse with details and/or large amounts of gratuitous nudity, kind of like Kanokon. I generally let it go if it’s present to some degree but not overtaking the main point of the story: in short, a little or some won’t completely undo it for me.
- I admit that this is motivated in part because I want to continue watching certain shows and not rule them out completely simply because of the presence of some kinds of fan service. I don’t think this necessarily cancels out every other virtue of the show. Selfish? Probably. I like my Haruhi and its originality just like Rah’ra, and my Welcome to the NHK! I find Zero no Tsukaima (season 1 at least) funny–and there’s a reason I Iabeled it a guilty pleasure. But in general, one or even two scenes with a commander in a bra won’t ruin the entire thing and make me unable to take it seriously, at least not by itself. (If it’s a huge pattern, though…and even in ZnT, the fan service often serves the clear purpose of advancing the comedy. Sex can be funny business!)
- There are plenty of examples in western media where one might judge that certain scenes are unnecessary and a detriment to the story. I felt that way about Shakespeare in Love, an otherwise charming and clever, literate film. Some movies don’t need as much violence as they portray to get their point across. But that doesn’t mean it must all thrown out instantly. In anime, a great example is the 1980s movie, The Wings of Honneamise. It is a fine work of sci-fi worldbuilding, about an alternative space program and the hopes and dreams of a lowly pilot who wants to become the first astronaut. There is an astounding amount of detail and intelligence in the writing, and the animation holds up even today. And yet there is a scene that seems to jump out of nowhere with some nudity, with an attempted rape actually, that is jarring and really inappropriate. Is that a demerit against the film? Yes; it turned me off. Badly even. Does it completely ruin everything about it? For me, no. I would note it in any review and speak my piece accordingly, as I did recently with regard to Nogizaki Haruka, but I think it would be unfair to judge the entire thing through that lens. Admittedly, with some shows, this gets quite hard; one must wade through 4-5 episodes of fan service to get to the really good parts of Mai Hime for instance (and if you read my review of the same, you’ll know that I made a strong personal connection with my situation at the time). I guess one question where we may have to agree to disagree is whether it is, in general, worth it to continue with a given show or movie to get to the “good stuff.” A typical strategy seems to start with fan service and then start sneaking in the real story. Sometimes it’s not always an escape hatch from good characterization and plot, as alleged. It may actually be the hook that precedes the line and sinker.
- The additional point that might be raised there is that, while maybe as an otaku I can overlook or forgive it, those who aren’t will have a harder time doing so. I can see this as legitimate in a way, though a huge part of the problem, at least in America, is simply the culture is still shocked that this kind of material is present in animated form. There is still the very strong idea that “cartoons are for kids.” Perhaps this is why for those who aren’t used to it, fan service/T&A seems so much more shocking in animated form than when it’s done in live action shows like Sex and the City or Gossip Girl. It seems that much more “pornographic.” I suspect that making anime “mainstream” in the sense that Rah’ra wants, where ordinary joes will treat anime with exactly the same consideration as the latest Michael Bay or Spielburg flick, is doomed to failure so long as that attitude remains in place. The foreignness doesn’t just come from the Japanese settings and character names and even cultural attitudes (shy, passive, wimpy guys just never get made into protagonists much here in America). It is foreign to many people that you can even tell a serious, non-satirical story in animated form, or have “adult” elements in much greater anatomical detail than the Family Guys and South Parks (the latter is as crude as many anime I’ve seen, and often just as violent. Those are the exceptions that prove the rule, incidentally). Before any mainstreaming happens, that very tall hurdle must be overcome, and getting rid of fan service by itself won’t make it happen. Though I think it would help.
At the end of the day, fan service is simply another example of “sex sells,” something that most modern westernized popular media–including anime–indulges in. I definitely wish there were less of it, and I consider it a demerit in most shows I watch. Does anime do too much of it? Probably, especially in otaku pandering type work. Is it porn in exactly the same way or as undeniably so as a hardcore movie? While there are real similarities, I think the answer is no. I do have certain lines I try not to cross in my own life, regardless of how great reviews are (I draw the line at Kanokon for instance, which received quite a few good reviews across the blogosphere) but there are plenty of shows out there whose genuine virtues as stories and art are not necessarily wholly ruined. Of course if the issue is more about “mainstreaming,” then I think the solution is to highlight the fact that not all anime has or needs fan service, and that there is always some great material out there that does have good storytelling without much, if any, resort to fan service. The 1 AM harem shows were meant for a small audience even in Japan, and need not necessarily be the only or the main public face of anime to the world.
Whew. That’s enough. I have some job-hunting and self-retraining to do. That’s my piece on the subject, and if you want something more philosophical on the subject, read my gender article. I’ll say no more.
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You need to have better screening for editorialists.
His works were very crude and extremely provocative. Not to mention his bigotry knew no bounds.
@DrmChsr0: Thank you for your comment. I believe there is substance in his arguments that is worth publishing and engaging. I do not necessarily agree with everything said, nor with rhetoric used, but I also think that open and free exchange of ideas is for the better, particularly when the opinion falls outside the aniblogger consensus. The issues he raises are important and real, and by opening them up to comments are being held up to fair public scrutiny. Moreover, he writes about many other subjects along with this one with competence and distinction. I stand by my choice of adding him to our staff.
Bigotry? Provocative, sure, and I’ve been out of the blogosphere for a few weeks… but linkage, plz, or it didn’t happen.
But anyway, well said, Mike. I’d also be a proponent of more thought-provoking anime and less nice-boats and dragonauts. This comming from a guy who found the concept of Zero no Tsukaima thought-provoking in theory, but stale and excessive of fanservice in practice. Of course, there are those shows that lead the cheesecake before getting to the good stuff, and those shows that can get away with a few “omg what where the producers thinking” scenes due to having a superior over-plot. But there are still those “redeemable” shows that I wouldn’t consider showing my friends, as the fan service ‘calorie content’ still exceeds something a person of Christian or other religious principles would consider excessive.
I can’t think of such a show that I’ve watched in recent memory, but I’m sure someone in the audience would be happy to rattle off several. Nogizaka is young in its run, and shows potential to go either way. I do fear it heading down the dark path despite the interesting subject of an outcast otaku schoolgirl. It’s just got too much harem vibe, which even so-called “great” anime like Code Geass have at times. The harem thing can be done tastefully, but more often than not, I find it degrading to women and only good for the cheap laughs. If the harem genre was equal opportunity and we saw more “inverse harem” shows, I might feel differently and call it just another flavor of fiction, but as the inverse harem show is rare to unheard of…
I’m inclined to agree that our beloved art form could use some innovation about now. But the same could be said of American Primetime: evening serials, by which I mean shows like Lost and Heroes, which are the EVA’s, GITS’s, and Code Geass’s of American Primetime TV, are all to few in number. Compare that to all the pre-packaged proceedurals (we really need another police drama?) and cookie-cutter comedies (though to a much lesser extent, of late) rule the roost, we have a similar problem with “standard fanservice anime” being churned out in the motherland. But only once every several years does an EVA, GITS, or Geass break through and shake things up. Though I do look forward to seeing the long term effects of Geass on “the chessmaster” character archetype and on the mecha genre, and perceptions of what can be done within it, in general.
I fear a may have gotten a bit tl;dr, myself. >.>;;
Like you I generally hate shows that glorify fanservice. I don’t like it when I have to watch anime that overdo the fanservice before getting to the real meat of it. Obviously my christian views are the cause for this, but my views disregarded, fanservice is more often detrimental than useful in making, in my opinion, a good anime.
“Obviously my christian views are the cause for this, but my views disregarded, fanservice is more often detrimental than useful in making, in my opinion, a good anime.”
What does Christianity have to do with this? I’d like to remind you that the Bible has a lot of sexuality in it. Particularly, a passage having to do with Egyptians having large and rock-hard penises. (iirc)
As much as I was quite unhappy with his Rah’ra’s choice of words and his over sweeping statements, I’d have to say he’s no biggot because I know him personally, and what he really really really wanted to say was: “I hate too much fan service!” and “I want to see more meat and potatoes without panties on top of them!”
This guy just needs to word them better. XD
Sometimes I wonder if disgust at fan service is not, in some small part, projected disgust in ourselves.
Perhaps the greater problem is not the anime…
@Shiki: I can’t add too much more really. :) But rest assured I did in fact read it all!
@Ez: Agreed. And partly on the same basis, though excessive fanservice offends my aesthetic tastes as well in general. If only the redeemable stuff wasn’t so redeemable sometimes. :)
@jp_zer0: the Bible was definitely not written by prudes. The proscription against pornography is based on the belief that the deliberate of inciting of lust is a breaking of the commandment against adultery (as Jesus connected lust to adultery in the heart). Context and use is key, of course; not all nudity is pornography, or violence gratuitous. The explicit parts of the Bible are couched within a context of an overarching narrative and moral/theological framework.
@rayyhum777: agreed. He is no bigot.
@Kai: ah, so a dislike of certain aspects of anime must be due to self-hatred and self-disgust and not for genuine aesthetic or moral reasons? I see. (I mustn’t run away, I mustn’t run away, I mustn’t run away…) :)
I would have to agree with Ray about, despite the provocative method of trying to get the message across, the heart of the matter Rah was trying to get at is something along the lines of, “What’s with all this cheesecake? WHERE’S THE BEEF!?” amirite??
@Mike/jp_zer0 - I think that Adultery of the heart addage is at the crux of most Christians objection to anime in general, and if not, the objectification of women through fanservice certainly is.
@Mike/Ray - No bigot, indeed.
@Mike/Kai - I think it’s fairly obvious that I tend to think there’s more substance here to the moral and artistic angle, rather than writing this off as moralistic self-loathing. Name me an Anime that panders specifically to Anime fans that doesn’t have excessive fan service? In recent memory, I can think of… maybe Lucky Star. And perhaps the reason for its controversy in the fandom is because of it’s somewhat mundane humor and lack of T/A/Pantsu. Feel free to sound off.
@Ray - One thing I don’t think you’ve made absolutely transparent - but I could probably guess the answer to - is your opinion on whether or not fanservice is good for anime or not.
You are failing to realize that we’re all single. “Adultery of the heart” makes little sense in that case.
Anyhow, everyone other than Ez probably agrees that any claim of any religious mysticism, when scrutinized, ends up in nonsense. His display of valiant Christianity has more to do with his personal “prudeness” than a careful scriptural analysis. This does nothing to help the nonsense of the whole argument. :D
Who I am kidding anyway? I committed blasphemy countless times, a sin that can never be forgiven.
Objectifying of women, interesting. I could swear that drawings were exactly that, objects. The real problem is transposing fiction to reality isn’t it?
@Shiki - your point about Lucky Star is very interesting. Actually I never really figured out what the controversy was, but yeah I think some people argued that it wasn’t funny. But yes, it caters specifically to Otaku, but perhaps not necessarily to some Otaku tastes/preferences due the lack of T&A. Another example of a show appealing, or more like acting like an insider joke is Genshiken. Except Onno, who’s fully clothed most of the time but shows a little bit bounciness, there are almost no fan service elements, at least I can’t think of any. In the Genshiken manga, there are some tongue in cheek fan service making fun of fan service while sort of catering to some people, and in the very end, there was a short omake about Madarame trying to label the female members in Genshiken as typical anime characters, with Onno being service character, Ogiue being tsundere, and there was a hint that Kasukabe is the silly and clueless oneesan. Sasahara’s sister’s never been defined as a anime character because she’s just so different…
In any event, to me, Lucky Star and Genshiken proved that you can have shows catering to Otaku without true fan service.
@jp_zer0 - well the argument could also go in a loop if I say drawing women makes them into objects and hence the objectifying process. But I rather not go into any loops at all; lord knows I’ve had a long day and too long a life to waste time on more loops. Fruit Loops, on the other hand, are delicious…
Ahem XD. Anyhow, people fantasize and to put it bluntly, jack off to different things. So I for one would like the statement “transposing fiction to reality” be further defined.
“transposing fiction to reality” might be better understood that way: “The womanifying of objects.”
In the sense that we shouldn’t expect real women to behave like cartoons and that conversely, women should not feel like they should behave like in cartoons.
the “objectifying of women” isn’t a problem when it’s fiction IMO. It doesn’t degrade any living person and serves to satisfy some urges. Everybody wins.
@jp_zer0 - Ah, I see. I can definitely understand that. You’re right about we shouldn’t expect women to behave like their animated counterparts. After all, most of us have common sense and realize that girls don’t behave like these animated characters.
One thing I want to point out is that, many closet fujoshi in Japan, do imitate anime characters, most time from shojo manga, but Hirano Aya said: “uguu” once. There is the danger (or the simply coolness when a seiyuu does it) of confusing fiction with reality in any context.
A large glob of PVC is made into a naked girl character complete with womanly assets. Does it make you horny, baby? Does it? XD
That’s my last say on that.