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	<title>Comments on: Beginner Anime</title>
	<atom:link href="http://animediet.net/commentary/beginner-anime/feed" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://animediet.net/commentary/beginner-anime</link>
	<description>Eating it right about anime since 2006!</description>
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		<title>By: Toonleap</title>
		<link>http://animediet.net/commentary/beginner-anime/comment-page-1#comment-7367</link>
		<dc:creator>Toonleap</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Apr 2009 20:08:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://animediet.net/?p=6330#comment-7367</guid>
		<description>Thanks for your quick answer...I think I will find more info on that girl and probably will check out the anime...looks interesting... :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for your quick answer&#8230;I think I will find more info on that girl and probably will check out the anime&#8230;looks interesting&#8230; :)</p>
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		<title>By: moritheil</title>
		<link>http://animediet.net/commentary/beginner-anime/comment-page-1#comment-7360</link>
		<dc:creator>moritheil</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Apr 2009 16:37:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://animediet.net/?p=6330#comment-7360</guid>
		<description>&lt;strong&gt;@ghostlightning&lt;/strong&gt; - Very well put. I also wanted to explore the disconnect between what we now term &quot;beginner anime&quot; and the concept that only beginners would watch such fare.  Interestingly, &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.awesome-engine.com/2009/04/22/lum-a-day-089-lum-ataru-%e2%80%93-a-night-alone/&quot; title=&quot;I&#039;ll just link you there&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Urusei Yatsura has quite a few references&lt;/a&gt; to other material, though it&#039;s from movies, not other anime shows. (It is, of course, a 1980s anime and 1970s manga.) I suppose someone could try to put together a &quot;references in anime&quot; timeline.

&lt;strong&gt;@Omisyth&lt;/strong&gt; - Indeed.  Come for the references and in-jokes; stay for the trenchant social commentary.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>@ghostlightning</strong> &#8211; Very well put. I also wanted to explore the disconnect between what we now term &#8220;beginner anime&#8221; and the concept that only beginners would watch such fare.  Interestingly, <a href="http://www.awesome-engine.com/2009/04/22/lum-a-day-089-lum-ataru-%e2%80%93-a-night-alone/" title="I'll just link you there" rel="nofollow">Urusei Yatsura has quite a few references</a> to other material, though it&#8217;s from movies, not other anime shows. (It is, of course, a 1980s anime and 1970s manga.) I suppose someone could try to put together a &#8220;references in anime&#8221; timeline.</p>
<p><strong>@Omisyth</strong> &#8211; Indeed.  Come for the references and in-jokes; stay for the trenchant social commentary.</p>
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		<title>By: Omisyth</title>
		<link>http://animediet.net/commentary/beginner-anime/comment-page-1#comment-7358</link>
		<dc:creator>Omisyth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Apr 2009 20:55:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://animediet.net/?p=6330#comment-7358</guid>
		<description>Good post. I don&#039;t think it matters if a show is &quot;beginner&quot; or &quot;advanced&quot; per se; of either type, if it&#039;s still accessible and any watcher can enjoy it (for instance with Zetsubou Sensei) then there isn&#039;t really a problem. 

Kind of reminds me of something I was studying about Shakespeare, where in some plays he wrote partly for the more learned people of society with discussions on the nature of leadership or law, for example, and partly for the masses, with his comedic sketches. Everyone still had something to enjoy, in any case.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good post. I don&#8217;t think it matters if a show is &#8220;beginner&#8221; or &#8220;advanced&#8221; per se; of either type, if it&#8217;s still accessible and any watcher can enjoy it (for instance with Zetsubou Sensei) then there isn&#8217;t really a problem. </p>
<p>Kind of reminds me of something I was studying about Shakespeare, where in some plays he wrote partly for the more learned people of society with discussions on the nature of leadership or law, for example, and partly for the masses, with his comedic sketches. Everyone still had something to enjoy, in any case.</p>
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		<title>By: ghostlightning</title>
		<link>http://animediet.net/commentary/beginner-anime/comment-page-1#comment-7351</link>
		<dc:creator>ghostlightning</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Apr 2009 01:04:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://animediet.net/?p=6330#comment-7351</guid>
		<description>If there were any references in the earliest anime I&#039;ve seen, I most certainly missed them:


&lt;i&gt;Choudenji Machine Voltes V
Mazinger Z
Toshho Daimos
Scientific Ninja Team Gatchaman
Space Battleship Yamato&lt;/i&gt;


etc. Hmm, even in the second wave of anime I&#039;ve seen (at this point around 7 years old I&#039;ve no distinction for the concept of &#039;anime&#039;) I don&#039;t get any references (even in hindsight):


&lt;i&gt;SDF Macross
Laserion
Cedie (Little Lord Fontleroy)&lt;/i&gt;


etc.


Hmm even in the third wave of anime I&#039;ve seen (at this point I was in high school going on university) I missed any references in shows that aren&#039;t sequels:


&lt;i&gt;Dragon Ball Z&lt;/i&gt; (technically a sequel but I hadn&#039;t seen the original)
&lt;i&gt;Ghost in the Shell
Akira
Ninja Scroll&lt;/i&gt;


I only started seeing referential shows like &lt;i&gt;Lucky Star&lt;/i&gt;, &lt;i&gt;Gurren Lagann&lt;/i&gt; a few years ago. Could it be I was lucky to have only been watching &#039;beginner anime?&#039;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If there were any references in the earliest anime I&#8217;ve seen, I most certainly missed them:</p>
<p><i>Choudenji Machine Voltes V<br />
Mazinger Z<br />
Toshho Daimos<br />
Scientific Ninja Team Gatchaman<br />
Space Battleship Yamato</i></p>
<p>etc. Hmm, even in the second wave of anime I&#8217;ve seen (at this point around 7 years old I&#8217;ve no distinction for the concept of &#8216;anime&#8217;) I don&#8217;t get any references (even in hindsight):</p>
<p><i>SDF Macross<br />
Laserion<br />
Cedie (Little Lord Fontleroy)</i></p>
<p>etc.</p>
<p>Hmm even in the third wave of anime I&#8217;ve seen (at this point I was in high school going on university) I missed any references in shows that aren&#8217;t sequels:</p>
<p><i>Dragon Ball Z</i> (technically a sequel but I hadn&#8217;t seen the original)<br />
<i>Ghost in the Shell<br />
Akira<br />
Ninja Scroll</i></p>
<p>I only started seeing referential shows like <i>Lucky Star</i>, <i>Gurren Lagann</i> a few years ago. Could it be I was lucky to have only been watching &#8216;beginner anime?&#8217;</p>
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		<title>By: moritheil</title>
		<link>http://animediet.net/commentary/beginner-anime/comment-page-1#comment-7349</link>
		<dc:creator>moritheil</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Apr 2009 21:06:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://animediet.net/?p=6330#comment-7349</guid>
		<description>Thanks for your comments.
 
 &lt;strong&gt;@IKnight&lt;/strong&gt; - Accessibility is perhaps not the precise word, as you point out, but somehow the experience does need to line up with something desired by the audience (even if they didn&#039;t necessarily go in seeking that particular thing.)  In the case of people who want something opaque, I would argue it&#039;s that actually inscrutability that makes the work accessible to them.
 
 &lt;strong&gt;@Kiri&lt;/strong&gt; - We know products which are useless to us are simply aimed at a different group of consumers.  Yet somehow when we start viewing anime, we sometimes have a strange tendency to not imagine another group that it might be aimed at.
 
 &lt;strong&gt;@Toonleap&lt;/strong&gt; - Thanks! That is Tanaka Punie from &lt;em&gt;Dai Mahou Touge&lt;/em&gt;, wearing her black uniform.  (Her &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/thumbnails/fit200x200/encyc/A6473-8.jpg&quot; title=&quot;Well, relatively normal.&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;normal dress&lt;/a&gt; is pink and frilly.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for your comments.</p>
<p> <strong>@IKnight</strong> &#8211; Accessibility is perhaps not the precise word, as you point out, but somehow the experience does need to line up with something desired by the audience (even if they didn&#8217;t necessarily go in seeking that particular thing.)  In the case of people who want something opaque, I would argue it&#8217;s that actually inscrutability that makes the work accessible to them.</p>
<p> <strong>@Kiri</strong> &#8211; We know products which are useless to us are simply aimed at a different group of consumers.  Yet somehow when we start viewing anime, we sometimes have a strange tendency to not imagine another group that it might be aimed at.</p>
<p> <strong>@Toonleap</strong> &#8211; Thanks! That is Tanaka Punie from <em>Dai Mahou Touge</em>, wearing her black uniform.  (Her <a href="http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/thumbnails/fit200x200/encyc/A6473-8.jpg" title="Well, relatively normal." rel="nofollow">normal dress</a> is pink and frilly.)</p>
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		<title>By: Toonleap</title>
		<link>http://animediet.net/commentary/beginner-anime/comment-page-1#comment-7346</link>
		<dc:creator>Toonleap</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Apr 2009 17:45:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://animediet.net/?p=6330#comment-7346</guid>
		<description>Nice article... :)

btw, I was wondering whos the girl in the first pic?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nice article&#8230; :)</p>
<p>btw, I was wondering whos the girl in the first pic?</p>
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		<title>By: Kiri</title>
		<link>http://animediet.net/commentary/beginner-anime/comment-page-1#comment-7345</link>
		<dc:creator>Kiri</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Apr 2009 13:59:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://animediet.net/?p=6330#comment-7345</guid>
		<description>Honestly, this needs to be true of all media, whether anime, manga, movie, video games, whatever. If a product isn&#039;t accessible then it has no audience, then there&#039;s no point, and all media is a product to be consumed. Some products are more esoteric than others and that&#039;s fine, it&#039;s why sites like thinkgeek and the ilk flourish as well -- but a niche audience is still an audience and thus the product is still a product.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Honestly, this needs to be true of all media, whether anime, manga, movie, video games, whatever. If a product isn&#8217;t accessible then it has no audience, then there&#8217;s no point, and all media is a product to be consumed. Some products are more esoteric than others and that&#8217;s fine, it&#8217;s why sites like thinkgeek and the ilk flourish as well &#8212; but a niche audience is still an audience and thus the product is still a product.</p>
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		<title>By: IKnight</title>
		<link>http://animediet.net/commentary/beginner-anime/comment-page-1#comment-7341</link>
		<dc:creator>IKnight</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Apr 2009 06:58:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://animediet.net/?p=6330#comment-7341</guid>
		<description>They&#039;re certainly labels.

The first anime I ever watched all the way through was &lt;em&gt;Martian Successor Nadesico&lt;/em&gt;, which is about as laced with references and tropes as you can get (even its Japanese title alludes to two other franchises). I spotted very little of what was happening, but enjoyed it heartily anyway, because it&#039;s funny and, underneath its outer skin of stupidity, rather cunning. (Nowadays I can spot more of what&#039;s going on, but I&#039;m sure there&#039;s a lot in &lt;em&gt;Nadeisco&lt;/em&gt; I still miss.) I don&#039;t know if that would&#039;ve happened if I&#039;d been watching, say, &lt;em&gt;Pani Poni Dash&lt;/em&gt;, which has less of a story to sustain itself.

I wouldn&#039;t agree that anime always has to be accessible, though. There are some viewers who want inaccessibility, opacity, alterity: drunk fifteen-year-olds who want to try some of that anime stuff because it&#039;s reputedly zany and not for kids, for example, or art film fans who want to be made to feel cosmopolitan by watching something in a foreign language from a long way away.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>They&#8217;re certainly labels.</p>
<p>The first anime I ever watched all the way through was <em>Martian Successor Nadesico</em>, which is about as laced with references and tropes as you can get (even its Japanese title alludes to two other franchises). I spotted very little of what was happening, but enjoyed it heartily anyway, because it&#8217;s funny and, underneath its outer skin of stupidity, rather cunning. (Nowadays I can spot more of what&#8217;s going on, but I&#8217;m sure there&#8217;s a lot in <em>Nadeisco</em> I still miss.) I don&#8217;t know if that would&#8217;ve happened if I&#8217;d been watching, say, <em>Pani Poni Dash</em>, which has less of a story to sustain itself.</p>
<p>I wouldn&#8217;t agree that anime always has to be accessible, though. There are some viewers who want inaccessibility, opacity, alterity: drunk fifteen-year-olds who want to try some of that anime stuff because it&#8217;s reputedly zany and not for kids, for example, or art film fans who want to be made to feel cosmopolitan by watching something in a foreign language from a long way away.</p>
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